Oh What A Mess

[Furyan66]

Hey Fury,
I am truly sorry that you find yourself in this situation. I am worried about you, and about the girl who you mention. Dealing with death is something that the human mind does very poorly. It's actually something that the mind cannot reconcile. If a person is lucky, their mind can effectively compartmentalize those memories and learn to live beside them. But it never really gets over them. The more tragic the death, the harder it is to employ those defense mechanisms. You didn't mention if she was on medication. I know that she is self medicating with alcohol, but I wonder if she is also on a prescription medication. You mention that she is seeing a psychologist. In a case of someone who has attempted suicide, I am not sure that is enough...and I say that as a former psychologist. Psychologists are so partial to cognitive therapy and cog has its limitations when dealing with something like this. On the other hand, many psychiatrists go to the other extreme and just want to script for something and be done with it. She probably needs a bit of both. She needs to get it touch with her feelings and realize that this is a process and that her goal is to be able to live along side what happened without letting it derail her life. That tact works for many, over time. Some will require a benzo or an AD (I prefer the benzo) to give them a hand at first. Some will need the benzo indefinitely. You will be hard pressed to find a psych who agrees with that, but its mostly because they are worrying about their own legal liability. Benzos help people blot out reality. If a person went to a doctor because their entire family were killed in a car crash, ANY doctor would prescribe them. The goal is to get that person to a point where they can deal, then wean them off the med.What some doctors fail to acknowledge is that some people never reach the point where they can deal. So if the benzo works in the short term (which it does), it will also work in the long term. I had a client whose 4 year old daughter drowned in the tub while she was in the next room blasting music through headphones. Put her on a heavy dose of benzos at the start, started cog, tried to ease up on the benzos over time, but all her progress was instantly lost. Cog went on for 18 months and it became apparent that this woman was never going to be able to effectively compartmentalize the event (would any of us be able to?) and she needed to continue to blot it out as best she can. When I left the practice, seven years later, she was still on the same dose of ALP and we were also giving her t-pam (as a sleeper). That would raise the eyebrows of more than a few doctors, but this is what worked for her.It allowed her to have her life back. Yes, she still grieved, but the guilt was tempered by the effect of the meds and her suicidal ideation faded over time. What I like about the benzos are that you can dose them so they don't completely blot out an event. In that way, the person can have some relief, while also continuing to work through the problem in their mind. And, yes, we left her on ALP instead of a long-actor (like clowns) because she needed ALP. I loved the owners of our practice because they were not afraid to do what they needed to do to help people. This may not be the answer for her, but I would hate to think of person who may be suicidal engaging only in cog. I would feel better knowing that she is being maintained on a med(s) right now as she works through this. In time, they may be able to add an AD, but not right away. If you care to give me some more information, I am here to listen.
Again, so sorry that are dealing with this. RM

Greetings All and thanks for your reply's..

She is seeing both a Psychologist and Psychiatrist. She does take an anti depressant Zoloft She is not on any Benzo as she is afraid of them. In addition to the Fentanyl found in here son's system they also found a good amount of Diazapam in his system and she is convinced she wants no part of the "Benzo" class of drug something that "helped to kill her son". She is a user of MM as she is also a 2 time survivor of both lung and brain cancer. This poor girl has been through hell and back and right now she cannot be trusted to be by herself but there is no way anyone can be with her 24 hours a day 7 days a week, I wish I was rich and could afford to just quit my job and take care of her but that is not going to happen. Her family is also trying to surround her with love but they to also have their
own families and job's and cannot be there every minute.

Per FF suggestion I am immediately going to try to find a "Grief Support Group" for parents who have been through this. It's only been 3 months since her son's passing so there is a LONG way to go. This wound will never really heal for her but I know she can learn to live with it if she can keep the hard liquor out of her life. I have seen alcohol destroy more lives than most drugs.....

Rafterman wise as always and thanks for all the feedback from all

Peace All

Fury

Fury,
I can understand her immediate aversion to benzos because of that experience, but her counselors should really try to break through and explain that benzos are actually extremely benign when taken alone. That is how she would be taking them, assuming they would replace the alcohol and not join it. The lethal dose of ALP is 7500MG's. Yes, 7500 MG's! You can die from taking 40 Tylenol, but it would take 7500 1MG tabs of ALP to kill you. Her counselors are treating her with an SNRI, which has an excitatory effect on the brain by increasing norepinephrine levels. IMO, what she needs right now is to not have her mind spinning out of control. It is true that increased norepinephrine levels can make a person feel happier, but they can also make a person feel amped. Many users can't handle them. I have seen clients have their first ever panic attack while on them. IF they insist on giving her an AD at this stage, I believe that they should have stuck with an old school SSRI. Both the SSRI's and the SNRI's raise serotonin levels and delay its reuptake, but the SSRI's do not effect norepinephrine levels. She's been through a grave tragedy. She has attempted suicide. She needs for her brain to work in a calm and orderly fashion.(as calm as possible, given the circumstances) She doesn't need a chemically-induced norepinephrine boost. Not right now. If they are fully aware of her case, then I accuse them of being reckless. ALP is approved by the FDA for treatment of both anxiety and depression. Its the only benzo that is, and you know how resistant the FDA is about approving any medication for anything. The reason that I am such an advocate of it is that I have observed it work as a wonder drug in so many people, including myself. Like any med, it can be abused..primarily by using it concurrently with alcohol or another depressant. I have to wonder if her counselors are taking into consideration that fact that she is regularly using alcohol right now and that is why they fear writing for the benzo. That could be, but my gut reaction is that they just like so many other counselors who are AD-happy and benzo-phobic. The should have at least gene-tested her before putting her on the AD. Maybe they did. Anyhow, all this is just my opinion. I think that she needed a benzo-only approach to start, then possibly benzo-ssri later on, and that whomever is treating her should not be afraid to maintain her on the benzo for as long as necessary...even forever.  RM

Thanks to all of you for your replies..

Hey RM you are very wise and I am glad you are a member of this forum.

I totally agree with you that I believe Alp'z would give here the best relief at this time but she is dead set against it since she found out that dia'z and alp'z are in the same category (Benzo's). I know it's a lot better option than tequila but I am not sure she can separate the 2. Right now you are so right when you said "her mind spinning out of control". She is going to work which is good as it keeps her mind occupied and even picked up so overtime to keep her busy. Major problem being is when she is alone she cannot be trusted. Between her family and I we do the best we can to keep her busy and keep people around her as much as possible but someone just cannot be with her all the time and that's when she is at her weakest.

I know she will never get over this but she can learn to live with it and she has got to get away from that damn alcohol. I enjoy a beer or 2 and a crown and coke once in a while but she cannot control her drinking and this is what is scaring me the most right now..

Peace All

Fury